Curse

chaos warrior zane · Sep 02, 2006, 09:11 AM // 09:11

For The Firking Asswholes Who Have Flamed Him.. Have U Read His Story?!?!?!?! 2 Words..............pure Genious!

Tongloid Tarthwood · Sep 02, 2006, 06:17 PM // 18:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by BahamutKaiser

This is my class idea, for what is typically known as a Vampire. A vampire usually has roots and origins in mythos and historical events, like Christianity, and Dracula.

Whoa! Slow down there. Christianity isn't a myth. Vampires aren't mentioned in the bible. Dracula isn't an historical event. Oh I see. You swap them around...Wait. That still doesn't work. Dracula isn't a myth either. It's a novel. For it to be a myth it has to not have a known author.

Asside from these minor mistakes, I really like the class idea. All I would really like to know is, what is it's target. You know, like mesmers are best against eles, and monks best against necros...That sort of thing. Who is it's target. I think it should be warriors. Warriors need to be targeted and I think this is he thing to beat it.

NeHoMaR · Oct 15, 2006, 11:09 AM // 11:09

I like Vampires. Anyway, Necromancers already have the Blood skills, is not easy make an all new Bloodline skills, but YES, is possible. Dervish has Earth and Air skills very different to Elementalists.

Dervish and Paragon are "angelical" classes, next chapter they must add the "devil" ones; Vampires, Werewolfs, Demons. We need more devil classes, not only the Necromancer. Well, Assassin is devil too.

BahamutKaiser · Oct 15, 2006, 03:47 PM // 15:47

I ment to say Mythos around Dracula, he was a real person, but he wasn't a real vampire, and the Mythos surrounding vampires and their relation to Christianity.

Personally, I find the whole concept of Vampires weakness to christian artifacts pathetic. The Bible makes no mention of Vampires or their significance, thus their very exsistance would nearly be a contridiction to the bible, so how can Vampires be weak to Christian artifacts if their very exsistance controdicts Christianities volidity? Things like this are the reason I perfer Vampiric stories with original plots and origins which don't involve inaccurate interactions between Vampires and Christianity.

As for the classes target, I like to believe that any good class has skills to counter any build, classes can be set up different ways with different skills to overcome nearly any other class. I do believe there is a semi circle of power in class setup, but with new classes coming all the time, they are more like conjointed rings. For instance, Mesmer is good at countering and interrupting enemies of any sort, whether it be any caster or any attacker. Elementist is good at overcoming groups, by dealing high damage on entire groups making it difficult to compensate (with healing), or Deal continuous spiking to a target to make it difficult at best too keep just that single target alive.

This is my idea of the original circle. Necromancer > Ranger because Necro has curses which are effective on more than one target, can slow their already slow attack, and because Ranger is the only other class who can bring an extra body to the field which will become fodder for Necromancers Death and Soul Reaping. Ranger > Elementist, because he can deal damage at full range, has extreme armor vs elemental damage, and has interrupts good enough to interrupt elementist very slow spells. Elementist is really the weakest in terms of superiority over any single class, but the most likely is Warrior, because he can nearly immobilize him wile bombarding him from perfect safety. Warrior > Mesmer, although mesmer has plenty of counters for everything because it is a counter class, interrupts go mostly unused against melee skills, and warrior can still fight well even if his energy is removed. Mesmer can easily beat Warrior if he is equip with certain hexes, but they are often geared toward casters, and a Warrior has plenty of extra skill slots to counter hexes if he is focusing on Mesmers, he definetly doesn't need to worry as much about defense. Mesmer is definetly > Monk, healing skills are fast, and no normal interrupter will catch a 1/4 or 1/2 cast spell. But Mesmer can slow down casting speed, punish casters for spamming spells, interrupt their spells, and attack their energy, Mesmer has skills to counter better than other classes because he lacks most anything else, but he is nearly required to counter good monk. Monk is simply > Necro, with skills geared toward overcoming Necromancer curses, Double damage vs undead creatures on Fire and Smiting damage skills, and the general ability to prevent deaths which overturns Necromancers talent to exploit it. As I said, any good class will have skills to counter most if not all other classes, there is one skill option or another, but this is my example of which ones are better in general vs eachother.

Now where does Stalker fit? Well if we look at Assassin as a guideline (and I will confess that I am dissapointed with Assassin), they deal Melee damage along with debuff/disabling skills simular to Mesmer and Necromancer. Assassin is in my opinion 50% Warrior, 20% Mesmer, 10% Necro and 20% Original. Their melee attack is different because energy based skills can be used immediately, and in quick succession, which is why they implemented the combo system to make it more difficult to spam your attacks. It lacks defense and instead has (not enough) shadowsteping (related to necro) and a variety of hexs (like Mesmer and Necro).

With my Stalker idea, we have basicly a Reverse Mesmer. Most of Mesmers skills revolve around disabling, interrupting, and depleating energy or adrenaline to prevent the enemy from doing damage, they have only a few skills which are crafted to punish a specific target for executing certain actions. Instead Stalker is geared toward overcoming the ability of an enemy, If he is good at hexing, the Stalker manipulates the hexer, if the enemy is good at attacking, the Stalker can morph and trade away casting capabilities for indominable physical power, if the Stalker is being hounded by spell attacks (particularly elemental) than he can setup wide area effects which weaken elemental damage and punish any enemies casting in the area, if the enemy is great at escaping, the enemy can capture them and hold them down til his team can overcome the target, and with that same ability, if the enemy can spike you to death in an instant, the Stalker can hold the life of an enemy hostage in order to create collateral damage on the enemy if they try to kill him.

If we examine the new expansion proffesions what we will see is that we have a new kind of melee attacker, a new kind of support and location based offense/defense, a new ranged attack and group supporter, and a new group damager. What we lack is a new type of counter class (Stalker). Although Ritualist technically revolves around summoning units to defend an area, we are somewhat lacking a good Familiar class which can bring a creature aboard to fight, like a bonified Summoner type class, but with Ranger, Necromancer, and Ritualist all bringing familiars to the table, I think that is a concern for chapter 5. In actuallity, a good way to invent a new kind of Pet class to the game without overflowing the summoning (multiple Minion) department would be a Mount Riding class, with a Mount which is simular to a pet rather than summoning Nature Rituals, Binding Rituals or several Minions, you have an alternative to Beast Mastery, that includes a riden "pet" and grants defensive capabilities rather than offensive addition. This is also probably the next most significant class missing from the game, an alternative Tank class. We are still lacking a good armored frontlinesmen alternative for Warrior, and personally, I would like to see something that is made to go in first and takes reduced damage from melee based on a mount skill.

skylyn · Oct 17, 2006, 04:56 AM // 04:56

Nice idea and all. But I'm tired of see'n toucher builds & this will only encourage an expansion of that build......

BahamutKaiser · Oct 19, 2006, 01:53 AM // 01:53

This class doesn't use touch spells, it uses a unique version of touch immobility. Seeing as the only real "toucher" build in the game is a hybrid class, there really isn't a "toucher" class in the game. Although most of the mechanics are melee attacks and spells.

I would have to say this isn't a "toucher" class, it is a "Grabber" class, they are just more peverted than Rangers pretending to be vampiric :P

OK, all funnyness aside, the actual feeding skills don't deal alot of "touch" damage, they deal primarily immobility with some health degeneration/regeneration effects, and life stealing damage counter. The actual Damage delt during a Feeding is DoT, meaning they cannot spam 3 spells in 2 seconds, but lose all function to Feed small amounts per second.

In actuallity, the Feeding concept is an incredibly unique alteration to any touch attack, with a primary focus on immobility, and a very different approach and threat. DoT is nothing on one enemy, and the traded defense against any allied spiking means that this cannot be stacked with any other attacks aside from previously applied hexes and condition. As such, a very unique role which remotely closest comparison is a hybrid of a few of one classes skills use by another class is more than original, and far from repeatative. It is about like comparing Ranged attacks with Projectile spells, except more difference.

Your poorly associated dislike of touch builds has almost nothing to do with this class, and as such, your disapproval is invalid.

Final point, these are Feeding skills, you can't use touch spell wile feeding, and no one on your team can do anything to your target wile feeding. 0 spiking, 0 touch spells, and incredibly original makes this more than acceptable, even on your scale. So perhaps you should spend more time thinking about how it actually works instead of making poor associations.

lyra_song · Oct 19, 2006, 04:52 PM // 16:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by BahamutKaiser

Your poorly associated dislike of touch builds has almost nothing to do with this class, and as such, your disapproval is invalid.

Everyone's entitled to their disapproval ;P This is the internet afterall.

You're gonna have to agree that just the title alone is gonna draw comparisons to the touch ranger build.

BahamutKaiser · Oct 21, 2006, 12:38 AM // 00:38

You can dissaprove anything you want. "I hereby dissapprove of Milk!"

But it doesn't matter if you dissapprove, no matter how much you don't like milk, some people do, and unless there is something wrong with milk for those who would like it, than they should have milk no matter how much you dislike it.

Now if you said you didn't like cigarette smoke, and even though you didn't choose to use it, it was hazardous for you if others used it around you, than it would be a valid dissapproval, because their use is harming you.

Likewise, you don't have to like the idea, there are plenty of people who do. And no matter how much you don't like it, if some people like it, and it works, and it is original, it is good enough for the game, and your dissaproval isn't significant.

Even worse than that, if you dissaprove of something for a reason that does not apply to said something, than your dissaproval is invalid. This is because your dissaproving of something that isn't involved with the subject, your just misassociating it.

That is just like saying all Muslems should be executed because you think extremist should be killed. Not all Muslems are extremists, thus they should not be killed, and just because you want to kill all extremist doesn't mean you want to kill all Muslems, you just haven't recognized the difference. Which is exactly what my response was too, an invalid and undeveloped dissaproval.

Several good class ideas have been compared to a Ranger with some secondary. Assassin and Paragon are prime examples of how you can use simular mechanics and still have a totaly original class, and Ritualist is a perfect example of how you can use a title which is the same as certain skills and even enemy titles used by another class. Char Rangers are called Stalkers!, Oh my god, we can't have that, anymore than we can't have Ritualist because Necromancer has Blood Ritual skills and White Mantle Necromancers are called Ritualists!. Pointless issue.

Go rent "Thank You for Smoking". and Learn something about debate.

lyra_song · Oct 21, 2006, 12:48 AM // 00:48

I think you need to clarify your post a little.

Bullet Points REALLY help people who only skim and dont read the whole thing.

Short, concise sentences.

Personally i like this idea, i just dont know how such a class would look like. Your writing is good, but you need to cut the fat.

Like your response to mine, it didnt need to be that long

BahamutKaiser · Oct 21, 2006, 01:00 AM // 01:00

Im not interested in what lazy people think. Lazy people are going to find fabricate dislikes no matter how much or little I write on the topic. Dilegent, Intelegent, Mature people will recognize the idea and appreciate it even if they don't like it for its stability and developement. And I just hope those are the kind of professionals working at Anet.

Shikaoru · Dec 17, 2006, 02:41 AM // 02:41

i would rather have a more rogue like stalker from ro: http://iro.ragnarokonline.com/game/jobstalker.asp
BTW i'm Back but not for long i play hacked ros now much more fun for me but i will come back someday.... maybe when nightfall comes

IrishCatholicNewYorker · Dec 17, 2006, 02:59 AM // 02:59

sounds cool in NF i've been seeing floggers i think that wold be a cool class you could use like whips and stuff

viskey · Jan 24, 2007, 05:38 PM // 17:38

i liked the idea of seduction, but wouldn't they just be like necros???

BahamutKaiser · Jan 28, 2007, 12:20 AM // 00:20

Would you read the OP again Viskey. I don't care to badger people for overlooking the concept, but if you recognize the abilities and gameplay involved in playing a Stalker, you wouldn't have a single relation between Necromancer and Stalker outside of nomial simularities.

General of the blade · Jan 30, 2007, 03:04 AM // 03:04

i think it's a nice idea

Pwny Ride · Jan 30, 2007, 09:22 AM // 09:22

We have necros for this.

BahamutKaiser · Jan 30, 2007, 10:15 PM // 22:15

You can't read can you Pwny? Necros can't Capture units, Transform into other creatures, Create Environmental Barriers, nor manipulate and punish foes for hexing..... or Self Ressurect. Not a single capability here is more than remotely related to Necromancer, and this class involves twice as many original techniques as any other class, but.... you can't read.

Yes I mean you, if you assume that this is anything like necro, you are a moron, just check yourself off as a moron if you did. Perhaps reading an idea may give you a real perspective of the concept next time. At least mature yet lazy people have the intellegence to ask how it is different than a necro (even though it is already detailed), instead of making ignorant claims that it is a necro.

Pwny Ride · Feb 15, 2007, 11:37 AM // 11:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by BahamutKaiser

You can't read can you Pwny? Necros can't Capture units, Transform into other creatures, Create Environmental Barriers, nor manipulate and punish foes for hexing..... or Self Ressurect. Not a single capability here is more than remotely related to Necromancer, and this class involves twice as many original techniques as any other class, but.... you can't read.

Yes I mean you, if you assume that this is anything like necro, you are a moron, just check yourself off as a moron if you did. Perhaps reading an idea may give you a real perspective of the concept next time. At least mature yet lazy people have the intellegence to ask how it is different than a necro (even though it is already detailed), instead of making ignorant claims that it is a necro.

Sorry to res this thread buut ~

Its just limited to a Necromancer.
Enviromental Barriers...hmm ever heard of wards?

You called it a VAMPIRE, and from what i recall necromancers are THE vampiric class, period.

Punishing foes for hexing...hmm oh yea, Smite Hex but you would'nt have possibly ever thought of that. But wait, im a MORON so what would i know

BahamutKaiser · Feb 16, 2007, 12:50 AM // 00:50

Yes you are a moron, If a new kind of AoE effect is broken than Binding Rituals are not acceptable because they provide environemental effects, and they also repeat use of spirits. Beyond that, Necromancers use Rituals, and are even know as ritualists.

a few simular capabilities are common among any new profession, and pretending the that some redeveloped abilities is the only thing this class has is ignorant. Your a moron, as I already said, there are a number of things this class can do that necromancer can not, and you were wrong, bringing up a few abilities simular to other classes doesn't make it a necro either, or an elementist or monk.

The new form of imparament and hostage taking is totaly original, and transformation abilities are more than original enough. But if we are elminating every remotely simular aspect because it is shared by another class than we can only have one energy user, one adrenaline user, and necromancer can't have curses because it rips off Mesmer.

Gee, you know who else can punish a foe for hexing? Mesmer, guess monk can't have Smite hex, because mesmer has Shatter Hex.

Simple fact is, this idea is more original than the vast majoirity of ideas no matter how far fetched and unusual their names are, and your a invalid so I woln't be reading any more of your ignorance. There are plenty of totaly new and redeveloped features about this class, and since you never bothered to read anything but the response, your an idiot.

General of the blade · Feb 16, 2007, 06:18 PM // 18:18

think you a little to deep in it, you got a necro and a vampire. vampire can suck blood, and necros suck hp, vampires have funny cloths so do necros...
the only why someone is gonna buy into this vampire idea is if you merge it with the necromancers.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BahamutKaiser

Yes you are a moron, your an idiot.

and their is no need for this ^ if you want to prove your point insults get you right were you started.

~this has been a GOTB lesson